General Discussion: A Reason For Not Living In Scotland


Show original post
misled
misled avatar

4252 posts since 3/1/02

18 Sep 2014 09:15
I voted yes.
MasterBlaster
MasterBlaster avatar

884 posts since 7/4/12

18 Sep 2014 09:24
Traitors!
Guido
Guido avatar

12884 posts since 20/4/05

18 Sep 2014 10:08
Andy, what are your thoughts on only Scots residing there currently getting a vote? It seems a little harsh to me if somebody who has moved for career purposes doesn't have a say in the future if their own country.
andymakesglasses
andymakesglasses avatar

20203 posts since 26/1/06

18 Sep 2014 10:25
People who have moved elsewhere for their careers have had 2 years in which to move back if they felt so strongly about it. One of the arguments for independence is to stop the "brain drain" by making Scotland a better place to do business.

I think it was 100% the correct decision Guido. I think it's only fair that the people who actually live here make the decision (and I say that with Scottish parents living in England with no vote, and a brother in a Scottish regiment currently serving in Australia with no vote).

It's not only Scots who have the vote, but any British citizens resident in Scotland, any EU citizens resident in Scotland and any Commonwealth citizens with leave to remain. There are around 900,000 people living in Scotland who weren't born here, getting on for 20% of the population.

If it was open to only Scottish-born people with no residence requirements then you would have long-term "ex-pats" with no real ties to Scotland other than it being their place of birth allowed to influence the day-to-day running of the country.
Guido
Guido avatar

12884 posts since 20/4/05

18 Sep 2014 10:32
Interesting. Thanks for the perspective. Using Twitter as a rough guide it seems to me that the Yes vote will walk it but maybe the No voters aren't as vocal…..
andymakesglasses
andymakesglasses avatar

20203 posts since 26/1/06

18 Sep 2014 10:45
Similarly "out on the streets" it seems that way too, but I think a significant proportion of No voters are conservative (with a small "c") and so perhaps less likely to be vocal about it.

Amongst my friends I only know two people who are voting No, but the vast majority of my friends are in creative industries which traditionally are more likely to be pro-independence.
ShaneB
ShaneB avatar

908 posts since 28/11/10

18 Sep 2014 10:54
Andy, the decision to make only residents of Scotland eligible to vote just shows how absurd the entire referendum is: serving British soldiers, who are Scottish but based in England, are denied a vote whilst, as reported in the Telegraph, a Pakistani student who's been in Scotland a whopping 4 years gets to decide on a 300+ year old union (who incidentally voted 'yes'). Interesting at least, if not a bit unfathomable.

As an Englishman, I hope you guys leave because it'd be better for England, but if I was Scottish, there's no way I'd be voting yes. It's madness.
Fuzzyduck121
Fuzzyduck121 avatar

1595 posts since 14/12/12

18 Sep 2014 10:56
Anyone know how many groats to the pound there will be if there is a yes vote?
Double D
Double D avatar

3552 posts since 8/3/07

18 Sep 2014 10:57
Guido wrote: Interesting. Thanks for the perspective. Using Twitter as a rough guide it seems to me that the Yes vote will walk it but maybe the No voters aren't as vocal…..
In terms of age demographic Twitter users are much more likely to vote Yes
Fuzzyduck121
Fuzzyduck121 avatar

1595 posts since 14/12/12

18 Sep 2014 11:03
I will be sad for the scots if its a no vote as they will have properly fucked themselves in my view.

I love scotland but honestly anyone who thinks it will be better on its own as a country of a few million with lots of social issues, no currency history and no EU membership is properly mental or a nationalist romantic.

Also before I get slated I also believe any one of the parts of the kingdom including England would be worse off on their own.
Olismallz
Olismallz avatar

872 posts since 7/2/12

18 Sep 2014 11:06
Is there any money to be made if a yes vote, in terms of trading groat/euro / groat/ gbp?
Double D
Double D avatar

3552 posts since 8/3/07

18 Sep 2014 11:09
Fuzzyduck121 wrote: I will be sad for the scots if its a no vote as they will have properly fucked themselves in my view.
I don't know about that, devo max is such a good deal for them (and not for the SE of England) that I now almost want them to vote yes.
andymakesglasses
andymakesglasses avatar

20203 posts since 26/1/06

posted 18 Sep 2014 11:22, edited 18 Sep 2014 11:22
If we vote No I'm pretty sure devo max won't happen for the exact reason you state.

It's worth remembering that devo max, not independence, was the preferred option for the majority of people in Scotland when the wording of the referendum was being discussed (I think I saw a poll stating 75% support at that time but I'm not completely sure on that). It was David Cameron who said that a devo max option couldn't be included on the ballot paper.
ShaneB
ShaneB avatar

908 posts since 28/11/10

18 Sep 2014 11:28
The Scots are taking liberties to be blunt - they don't realise how good they've got it and yet their politics reckon them to be so hard done by. The amount leverage they hold, proportionally, over the rest of the union is unparalleled.

DevoMax is BS for England; Cameron should have played hard ball and not offered them DevoMax. You can't set your own budget and devolve a whole host of executive and legislative powers to Scotland whilst still receiving a subsidy and have liabilities ultimately underwritten by the rest of the UK (read: England).
Mrtyn
Mrtyn avatar

969 posts since 30/1/14

18 Sep 2014 11:29
Devo max is far from set in stone amd is far from a great deal. It is also quite amazing how many Englishmen believe that Scotland is subsidised by the rest of the UK.
ShaneB
ShaneB avatar

908 posts since 28/11/10

posted 18 Sep 2014 11:32, edited 18 Sep 2014 11:32
Mrtyn wrote: Devo max is far from set in stone amd is far from a great deal. It is also quite amazing how many Englishmen believe that Scotland is subsidised by the rest of the UK.

It is - they ran a £12bn deficit in the last budget.

The only places in the UK that produce a tax surplus is London & the SE.
Mrtyn
Mrtyn avatar

969 posts since 30/1/14

18 Sep 2014 11:35
You're wrong plain and simple. It doesn't take an economic genius to understand why.

Mrtyn
Mrtyn avatar

969 posts since 30/1/14

18 Sep 2014 11:36
Here's one reason why.

http://m.scotsman.com/news/scotland-overpays-for-uk-debt-1-3185848

ShaneB
ShaneB avatar

908 posts since 28/11/10

18 Sep 2014 11:38

No it doesn't - servicing the national debt works out to about 2-3 p/c of Scotland's budget; in real terms I think it's about £3bn. Scotland has a deficit because it has too many liabilities.
andymakesglasses
andymakesglasses avatar

20203 posts since 26/1/06

18 Sep 2014 11:43
ShaneB wrote: The Scots are taking liberties to be blunt - they don't realise how good they've got it and yet their politics reckon them to be so hard done by.

Simply not true, we're not hard done by and don't feel that to be so. Alex Salmond can be a smug git at times but I agree with what he wrote in the original referendum consultation document:

Alex Salmond wrote: Scotland is not oppressed and we have no need to be liberated. Independence matters because we do not have the powers to reach our potential.