General Discussion: Black Lives Matter


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Hanto
Hanto avatar

2803 posts since 30/11/09

8 Jun 2020 12:22
darko wrote:
swiftus wrote:
Superprecise wrote: One thing I'm not going to do however is virtue signal and browbeat my white liberal friends on social media, or regurgitate memes and slogans.

What are your friends doing that counts as virtue-signalling and browbeating?

I agree with most of superprecise's post

virtue-signalling is related to intent i guess and is pretty difficult to 100% ascertain unless you can read someone's mind

there's a difference between ordering a book, reading it cover-to-cover and genuinely educating yourself (or making a donation to a worthwhile charity)
vs
thoughtlessly plastering shit all over your instagram story that you (in all likelihood) haven't read in order to make yourself look informed, or vacuously donating a measly amount to a cause and then posting screenshots of it all over social media to make you feel good about yourself

i don't buy into this 'silence is complicit' stuff either, just because someone hasn't spammed the shit out of social media and explicitly stated they aren't racist doesn't mean that they aren't well intentioned

This I think is where I am coming from. That Slacktivist article you reffed is essentially where I am coming from. I am not saying everyone is the same, but if you know people you are connected/friends with, it is quite easy to pick out who is one which side of the fence.
nothingelseworked
nothingelseworked avatar

3556 posts since 21/2/10

posted 8 Jun 2020 12:25, edited 8 Jun 2020 12:25
There's probably a lot of people that don't call out friends / family / colleagues on racism (regardless of how subtle/overt) because it's too much hassle/drama to say anything. I'm assuming that's the silence people are talking about rather than "he/she didn't post the black square". That's how I've interpreted it anyway.

Edit: I mean it can definitely be extended to the systemic racism that exists. If you're not actively helping to change things then you allow it to continue.

You don't need to go on a march or post on social media to change things. This is a great example of something that could have amazing impact:

Superprecise wrote: I'm an architect, which is unsurprisingly a very white profession, and I suspect that doing a talk in a school in a disadvantaged area could be worthwhile. There are programmes for doing such things. I imagine going into architecture doesn't really seem like an option to lots of kids and that's bad.
Sayword
Sayword avatar

5357 posts since 1/4/07

8 Jun 2020 12:56
Mr.X. wrote: Your silence makes you complicit to the white privilege racism.
this applies to white people in general. If your not telling your "black friends" about your racist white friends, you are complicit. Thos been the case since 1492.

This topic is real cute.

I hold a much stronger, polarizing view, if anything black lives are the only lives that matter, we been here since the beginning of time, literally. There would not be civilization without "black life," where it was created. Even today, where nearly all cultures has been set, or predicated by "black lives". The world is mostly "black" and decreasingly "white," and the world has given enough time for this world order. A new world order is upon us, and it won't be ruled by small hats and "white elites." The numbers never added up.

But this is all a capitalist white supremacist construct, black and white, and it's finished.

this post is neither here nor there, I thought there should just be an actual black voice in this thread, also I didn't read any of the other post, I just chuckled at the thought of reading the topic once I visited the website.
Kingmob07
Kingmob07 avatar

9105 posts since 11/5/07

posted 8 Jun 2020 13:20, edited 8 Jun 2020 13:20
It's interesting that the internet has made all of this possible, but could end up drowning out the kinds of discussion that will actually generate lasting change.

There's too many trolls, too many uber woke white people, and people more interested in creating memes than they are in actually wanting an end to racism.

As others have pointed out, I wonder if there'll still be protests once the online "interest" wanes.

On a side note, it made me laugh a little to see that one of the first people jumping on the Colston statue when it toppled looked white with dreadlocks. Is Bristol a particularly diverse city?
Wario
Wario avatar

11 posts since 3/2/20

8 Jun 2020 13:34
As a 15 percent Mediterranean ponytailed man, I've faced all varieties of unnecessary abuse and backlash over the years for the way I look. Indeed, the abuse was much less in the 90's when the longer haired chap was en vogue. I'm thinking, China Crisis (quite apt), Boy meets Girl, Desperado and or course, Marti Pillow.

However in the naughties I had everything from home-made flame throwers to being whacked from behind by a giant foam hand. Whilst a large group saw a turning point having held sit in protests in hair salons and outside Parliament, it fell on deaf ears and our voices fell silent.

Thankfully, our saviour, little did we predict, was a trend from Japan, the top-knot.
Mr.X.
Mr.X. avatar

3069 posts since 23/6/13

posted 8 Jun 2020 13:36, edited 8 Jun 2020 13:36
I accept my white privilege.

In future it would be beneficial if white people stated: "I accept my white privilege." then continued their post because if you don't openly admit it, you are the problem.

Kingmob07 wrote: It's interesting that the internet has made all of this possible, but could end up drowning out the kinds of discussion that will actually generate lasting change.

There's too many trolls, too many uber woke white people, and people more interested in creating memes than they are in actually wanting an end to racism.

As others have pointed out, I wonder if there'll still be protests once the online "interest" wanes.

On a side note, it made me laugh a little to see that one of the first people jumping on the Colston statue when it toppled looked white with dreadlocks. Is Bristol a particularly diverse city?
jacko198
jacko198 avatar

516 posts since 23/10/09

8 Jun 2020 15:18
Sayword wrote:
Mr.X. wrote: Your silence makes you complicit to the white privilege racism.
this applies to white people in general. If your not telling your "black friends" about your racist white friends, you are complicit.

What makes you think we all have racist white friends? You do realise that not every white person is racist right?

Im a bit bored of being told how to think, what I should be doing, that I should be "Educating" myself. Reading books on why black people aren't talking to white people about racism any more is genuinely not going to do anything for me. I know im not racist, I don't need to read a book to change my mind, its not going to help. Not that anyone who is genuinely racist is going to, 1st - Read it & 2nd read it and be miraculously cured of it. In the same way as me posting shit on social media won't make a difference.

Im also not massively into this "White Privilege " scenario. Life is what you make of it. I cant see how being black in the UK is an issue, you have the same opportunities of any of us in my opinion.
joeyjojo
joeyjojo avatar

4513 posts since 24/8/06

8 Jun 2020 15:30
^ bollocks ! So what you’re saying is black people are inherently ‘worse’ people than white ? And this accounts for the fact they are 3 x more likely to be arrested than a white person and every other crime based statistic involving black people?
joeyjojo
joeyjojo avatar

4513 posts since 24/8/06

8 Jun 2020 15:31
Laughing out loud ‘ Life is what you make of it. ‘ fucking hell
jacko198
jacko198 avatar

516 posts since 23/10/09

8 Jun 2020 15:35
joeyjojo wrote: ^ bollocks ! So what you’re saying is black people are inherently ‘worse’ people than white ? And this accounts for the fact they are 3 x more likely to be arrested than a white person and every other crime based statistic involving black people?

Where did I say black people are worse than white people? Puzzled
jacko198
jacko198 avatar

516 posts since 23/10/09

8 Jun 2020 15:38
joeyjojo wrote: Laughing out loud ‘ Life is what you make of it. ‘ fucking hell

Is it not? What is stopping anyone in this country from doing what they want? Just because someone is black doesn't mean they cant go to school, get a good education and do the job they want. The system is not the problem in the UK, unless you think that everybody is racist I cant see how you can think otherwise. Its on an individual level and not just a blanket statement
joeyjojo
joeyjojo avatar

4513 posts since 24/8/06

8 Jun 2020 15:39
No I’m asking you to explain why black people are 3x likely to be arrested, and likewise are disproportionate amount of black people in prison to. You’re saying society in UK treats all people the same, ‘life if what you make of it’ etc etc, then why is this the case ?
TROYBOY
TROYBOY avatar

838 posts since 28/2/12

8 Jun 2020 15:39
C-Stylez wrote:
morgan wrote: Racists don’t change overnight. This isn’t American History X.

Overnight? I seem to remember the racist in question did a few years in prison and ended up getting bummed by his Nazi buddies.

Which unfortunately might be the only way for some people.

Lol, case closed!! prison grub and a shafting from big bruno in C wing.
DuffMan
DuffMan avatar

14389 posts since 21/2/07

8 Jun 2020 15:51
jacko198 wrote:
joeyjojo wrote: Laughing out loud ‘ Life is what you make of it. ‘ fucking hell

Is it not? What is stopping anyone in this country from doing what they want? Just because someone is black doesn't mean they cant go to school, get a good education and do the job they want. The system is not the problem in the UK, unless you think that everybody is racist I cant see how you can think otherwise. Its on an individual level and not just a blanket statement

Shit like this is why these conversations are worth having even if your annoying mates are posting shit on instagram that they'll never actually do.

The system is rigged against those in poverty and without opportunities and BAME communities make up large proportions of those people. Then you add on that many systems of law, public services etc are stacked against those communities be that from an increased likelihood of say arrest, charge, case taken to court, sentencing etc etc through mandating someone to have ID to vote (significantly less likely in immigrant and minority communities).

It is clearly not the case that we all have the same opportunities in life, or that we will all be able to go so far without them. It's right to laud people who have great lives despite starting with nothing - but it's not right to say that people who start with nothing can just have a great life because they feel like it.

I don't really bother engaging with this stuff on FUK because it's not necessarily the place for serious discussion but come on.
Rez
Rez avatar

8554 posts since 5/4/09

8 Jun 2020 15:55
I really would recommend reading the book instead of getting angered by the title Laughing out loud
jacko198
jacko198 avatar

516 posts since 23/10/09

8 Jun 2020 15:55
joeyjojo wrote: No I’m asking you to explain why black people are 3x likely to be arrested, and likewise are disproportionate amount of black people in prison to. You’re saying society in UK treats all people the same, ‘life if what you make of it’ etc etc, then why is this the case ?

How am I to know why? Could it be because they are 3x more likely to commit crime or is it that the police are racist? Who knows!
Rez
Rez avatar

8554 posts since 5/4/09

8 Jun 2020 16:03
If you pm me your address I'll send you the book if you'd like and then you can find out?
swiftus
swiftus avatar

1400 posts since 1/7/09

8 Jun 2020 16:04
jacko198 wrote: Reading books on why black people aren't talking to white people about racism any more is genuinely not going to do anything for me

Fuck me, you know it all, right?

jacko198 wrote: I cant see how being black in the UK is an issue, you have the same opportunities of any of us in my opinion

How can you say this with such confidence, when you have absolutely no idea what it is like to be a person of colour? You've never walked a day in my shoes.
jacko198
jacko198 avatar

516 posts since 23/10/09

posted 8 Jun 2020 16:12, edited 8 Jun 2020 16:12
As a person of colour, can you go to school and university and get the education you want yes or no?

I am in no way of the opinion that racism exist, ofcorse it does, but the thought that every white person, be that police, government officials, or anybody else in the world is madness. The fact I haven't posted on my instagram about it, does that make me racist? Apparently so according to everyone on the internet!
Rez
Rez avatar

8554 posts since 5/4/09

8 Jun 2020 16:21
I don't think you understand what systemic racism is and I really do think having a read about it might help