General Discussion: Religion thread


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Mr X
Mr X avatar

7053 posts since 12/7/07

3 Apr 2010 11:07
Don't ask me questions, I don't know all the answers - I am not God.

I'm still learning and it doesn't help that everyday I sin.
eliotness
eliotness avatar

1506 posts since 1/2/09

3 Apr 2010 11:11
nick2 wrote:
eliotness wrote: Guido please take a second to think of all the great thinkers, leaders, writers, scientists, musicians and philosophers that have held religious beliefs and in comparison make you look like a brain dead moron and maybe think about reconsidering your "brainwashed idiot" statement.

People aren't clever because of their religion.

you're misinterpriting what I said.

I am not saying people are intelligient beacause of their religion, thats silly (although sometimes religion did act as a catalyst or inspiration for them to go on and do great things), I am saying that people are able to be intelligent amazing people and still maintain a religious faith.
andymakesglasses
andymakesglasses avatar

20640 posts since 26/1/06

3 Apr 2010 11:14
Mr X wrote: Do you believe in the OT-AMG?

I'm not sure I understand the question - I believe the Old Testament was written by people who believed what they were writing to be true. I'm an atheist though if that's what you were getting at.
Foxtrot
Foxtrot avatar

2477 posts since 8/4/09

3 Apr 2010 11:17
It has relevance to the overarching discussion. If your saying that 'anyone who believes in religion is a brainwashed idiot' you also should say that anyone who believes in science is a 'brainwashed idiot'. Science has yet to explain and probably will never be able to explain among other things, the laws of physics e.g the conservation of angular momentum. If a spinning object breaks apart on a frictionless environment the rocks that break off should spin in the same direction. But in our solar system 2 planets, (Venus and Uranus) and a few moons spin backwards.

Scientists believe that science is a more plausible alternative to religion. That simply isn' t true.
eliotness
eliotness avatar

1506 posts since 1/2/09

3 Apr 2010 11:24
exactly, you can't critisize religion for having unfounded beleifs when most scientific beleifs have to be re written regularly and are nothing more than theories, capable of being proven wrong and becoming out dated or incorrect at any moment.

however I suppose science has the benifit of being able to ammend it's laws and beleifs and admit mistakes and ignorance.
Foxtrot
Foxtrot avatar

2477 posts since 8/4/09

3 Apr 2010 11:29
true like they did revised the age of the universe about 10 times. slight exaggeration..
jimm
jimm avatar

1558 posts since 22/11/04

3 Apr 2010 11:29
Science might not be able to explain everything, but religion can't and never will do any better - the difference is at least science can admit it.

Maybe it can't explain some of your funny spinning planets, but it's done a hell of a lot more in understanding our universe than religion.

Would you even be alive today if it wasn't for the amazing scientific breakthroughs in our past Century? Get a grip.
D4N
D4N avatar

3087 posts since 27/9/06

3 Apr 2010 11:33
Since Christians believe the earth is thousands of years old, do you/they not believe in dinosaurs?
Guido
Guido avatar

12884 posts since 20/4/05

3 Apr 2010 11:35
Foxtrot wrote: It has relevance to the overarching discussion. If your saying that 'anyone who believes in religion is a brainwashed idiot' you also should say that anyone who believes in science is a 'brainwashed idiot'. Science has yet to explain and probably will never be able to explain among other things, the laws of physics e.g the conservation of angular momentum. If a spinning object breaks apart on a frictionless environment the rocks that break off should spin in the same direction. But in our solar system 2 planets, (Venus and Uranus) and a few moons spin backwards.

Scientists believe that science is a more plausible alternative to religion. That simply isn' t true.

Science doesn't claim to have the answers to everything just is the pursuit of answers.

You final statement is complete bullshit as well. Laughing out loud Religion is just that… a man made belief system used to control and by individuals to comfort an animal that has an understanding of their own mortality. It provides some with comfort in the inevitable and in that those they loved have not just gone forever.

It's not science v's religion. Science is just the pursuit of understanding.
Foxtrot
Foxtrot avatar

2477 posts since 8/4/09

3 Apr 2010 11:36
Well if it can't then it puts a spanner in the works for the big bang theory.
nick2
nick2 avatar

7231 posts since 18/2/09

3 Apr 2010 11:39
I think religion would be ok if people could just keep it to themselves, but they can't, they have to inflict it on everyone else.
Guido
Guido avatar

12884 posts since 20/4/05

3 Apr 2010 11:40
Foxtrot wrote: Well if it can't then it puts a spanner in the works for the big bang theory.

You're assuming that if the big bang theory cannot be fully explained then that gives validity to the fact the universe and everything in it is created by 'god'. That is just laughable and backs up my belief people who believe that are idiots. The reason that this belief system is in place is because those who think it to be the case have been told it is as they grew up. If that's not conditioning them to believe something aka brainwashing that I don't know what is. Why is it these people with religious beliefs tend to always follow those of their peers and not seek to choose the religion they believe the one to be true?

siriusmo
siriusmo avatar

894 posts since 12/4/09

3 Apr 2010 11:41
nick2 wrote: I think religion would be ok if people could just keep it to themselves, but they can't, they have to inflict it on everyone else.
eliotness
eliotness avatar

1506 posts since 1/2/09

3 Apr 2010 11:49
I don't think any body is getting into a "science vs Religion" argument guido and jimm.

Foxtrot was just making a (valid) point against you critisizing religous followers for believing in unfounded ideas.

Guido
Guido avatar

12884 posts since 20/4/05

3 Apr 2010 11:53
it's not valid at all though that's the point.

anyway I'm off out to follow the one true religion and worship at my alter. I'm going the pub to watch the footy.
Foxtrot
Foxtrot avatar

2477 posts since 8/4/09

3 Apr 2010 12:04
Guido, your jumping to conclusions. I merely said that both 'institutions', science and religion have unanswered questions and we should not discard one over the other. Science is well equipped to answer most of those questions through technology and developments. After all as you say it is the pursuit of understanding. But for those questions that remain unanswered for the time being why can't i sully your intellect and refer to you as the idiot when you too believe in a system that you hope will provide answers?

Science is a core subject taught in schools and we were told that the the big bang occurred. So how much of us were brainwashed? If scientists haven't proven the validity of the big bang through well grounded application of the laws of physics and therefore does not have all the evidence that suggests a universe not created by god or science, then your point about indoctrination also applies to the teaching of science in schools.

This crack on religion regarding brainwashing is an unhelpful and convenient mainstream opinion unsupported by any evidence whatsoever.
velvet
velvet avatar

9570 posts since 12/6/06

3 Apr 2010 12:15
weak people subscribe to organised religion. I'm with lily on this one..

Forget about guns and forget ammunition
Cause I’m killing them all on my own little mission
Now I’m not a saint but I’m not a sinner
Now everything's cool as long as I’m gettin thinner
eliotness
eliotness avatar

1506 posts since 1/2/09

3 Apr 2010 12:19
guido,
Granted it's not on the same scale as believing in an all powerful being that cannot be proved (or disproved for that matter), but science is quickly becoming a type of "religion" and i believe that it will completely replace religion as peoples source of inspiration, reassurance and guidance in this centuary.

With that in mind, how much do you really know about current scientific theories guido?

how confident are you that they are correct and wont be disproven, even within the next year?

Do you not see the hypocrisy in calling all religious followers brainwashed idiots for beleiving something that can be questioned so easily?

Granted scientific ideas can be proven (or at least convincingly theorised), but in reality it is only to an extent. They can rarely ever be completely proven as fact. It still doesn't hide the fact that you are beleiving something essentially untrue (although YES a lot less untrue than religion).

I don't want my original point to become lost in all the other points and the general change in direction of this thread. You are in fact ignorant and in some respects a hypocrite for saying all religious followers are brainwashed idiots.
nick2
nick2 avatar

7231 posts since 18/2/09

3 Apr 2010 12:41
eliotness wrote: science is quickly becoming a type of "religion" and i believe that it will completely replace religion as peoples source of inspiration, reassurance and guidance in this centuary

I think that can only be a good thing, remember it wasn't scientists who burnt priests at the stake for not believing/daring to question, as far as I know no scientists have even killed anyone for not believing their theories. I'm pretty sure if science took over from religion in countries like Africa they would be a lot better off.


eliotness
eliotness avatar

1506 posts since 1/2/09

3 Apr 2010 12:43
stop mis interpriting what i'm saying.

i didn't say any where in there that it's a bad thing, i fully agree with you.

i'm not religous.